Episodes

MORMONISM LIVE !: 011: The Rules of the Game

There are five rules to the game of Mormonism; all of them from the perspective of church leaders:

Rule No. 1–We are going to hide stuff from you.

Rule No. 2–We are going to try to keep you from finding the stuff we are hiding from you.

Rule No. 3–We are going to lie about hiding stuff from you.

Rule No. 4–You can’t blame us for hiding stuff from you.

Rule No. 5–If you talk about the stuff we are hiding from you, we will hide you. (See Rule No. 2)Once you understand the five “rules of the game,” everything else falls into place.

RESOURCES:

https://youtu.be/4hAL-qLOISs

https://www.deseret.com/2008/8/2/20379462/be-cautious-about-lds-history-articles-elder-oaks-says?fbclid=IwAR22qAPf6HvVfRVyLX_faN2NGYRqvuxMQj-VUA1I20y_votqlxiy-egQMgI

https://youtu.be/Eqi-ll1PSr0?t=1

https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/manual/teaching-seminary-preservice-readings-religion-370-471-and-475/the-mantle-is-far-far-greater-than-the-intellect?lang=eng&fbclid=IwAR3UdfA0Yy1EIhOpnaIr42oeR8pTPuSmNs-PdFd6NpL5gjX78e1wG8FSqas

https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/ensign/1986/01/truth-and-more?lang=eng&fbclid=IwAR3lTzVmfLSDIN22CSFzqtYRVpraCSTlnzt0U1k_zvoHGh8G9PwX9SfygG4

https://speeches.byu.edu/talks/russell-m-nelson/truth-and-more/?fbclid=IwAR0cxr5OaF7YED0mPLTq57yGcYg5C2SCHgY94bhxST_OzJxo92Fe6Yy5dnk

https://youtu.be/lsi3wLiyiEE?t=520

https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/church/news/president-oaks-counsels-young-couples-defending-the-gospel-on-the-frontline-?lang=eng&fbclid=IwAR22qAPf6HvVfRVyLX_faN2NGYRqvuxMQj-VUA1I20y_votqlxiy-egQMgI

https://youtu.be/Uj2VWhuW50w?t=2666

https://youtu.be/RPeIgjZ0EQg?t=742

https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/general-conference/1993/04/keep-the-faith?lang=eng&fbclid=IwAR3lTzVmfLSDIN22CSFzqtYRVpraCSTlnzt0U1k_zvoHGh8G9PwX9SfygG4

https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/media/video/2015-10-2060-elder-vern-p-stanfill?lang=eng&fbclid=IwAR3_4rgQQtelIZwdX-Dm5w6LqIWum5E78RDrDY2He8BeKhjRbi3v-j9zttI

https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/general-conference/2019/10/56andersen?lang=eng&fbclid=IwAR3J7TtWjDfYfVjO6xcFXNa1-M5XXsU_luV2H4tj-vKGYOAXRF8TKRR0ci4

https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/general-conference/2012/10/can-ye-feel-so-now?lang=eng&fbclid=IwAR0_-V_9p9yrxkD9zcCcVpT-szyykb_vcN54k1x83hpb4Zvf5CEOEHN0zzk

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7 thoughts on “MORMONISM LIVE !: 011: The Rules of the Game

  1. Hey there RFM,

    Excellent podcast. Very tight. You guys admirably followed the wisdom of the old southern preacher who, when asked how he could give such wonderful sermons, replied, “First I tells them that I’m gonna tell ’em. Then I tells them. Then I tells them that I done told ’em!”

    I do however have one quibble concerning the title of your podcast. I believe that it, like yourself, is perhaps a little bit too modest. Since these “rules of the game” have been laid down by the leaders of the church since its very inception, and their successors have continued to play it without deviating one jot or tittle for two hundred years now, is there not enough empirical evidence to scientifically assert that the tentative
    “Rules of the Game” should now be upgraded to “The Laws of the Game”?

    In response to “Research is not the answer” – (BTW, I wonder how that shtick would work on the road if Elder Oaks were giving an address at say Harvard, Yale, or the University of Utah, for that matter…), allow me to relate how even a rather innocuous search online for a quotation by a former prophet can quickly lead down one down a rabbit hole:

    I was doing a google search on Heber J. Grant to see if I could find a quote from him as regards Japan (ie. that the Japanese would flock to the church in such numbers as to astound the world for years to come). At any rate, I couldn’t find it. I just thought it odd that when I googled “Heber J. Grant”, his name came up with the sub-heading “Political Leader” (rather than 6th President of TCOJCOLDS). So I searched the names of all the prophets online to see how they are characterized in Google. I will give four examples:

    Ezra Taft Benson
    American Farmer

    Spencer W. Kimball
    Business Person

    Joseph Fielding Smith
    American Writer

    David O. McKay
    American Educator

    By doing a similar Google search typing in the names of the living “prophets, seers, and revelators” this is what comes up:

    Dallin H. Oaks
    American Jurist

    Dieter F. Uchtdorf
    German aviator

    Jeffrey R. Holland
    American educator

    Henry B. Eyring
    American author

    Quentin L. Cook
    American lawyer

    David A. Bednar
    (no further identifiers)

    D. Todd Christofferson
    American lawyer

    Ulisses Soares
    Brazilian businessman

    M. Russell Ballard
    American businessman

    Gerrit W. Gong
    Author

    Gary E. Stevenson
    American businessman

    Now Elder Uchtdorf, in particular, no doubt can be identified as a “German aviator”, and although I have always had the highest respect for aviators, even German aviators, I question if perhaps Elder Uchtdorf is not something more than just a German aviator. Thinking that this might be just a Wiki thing and that anyone can edit this info, I searched a little further and found that although one can offer feedback to Google to suggest a different epithet, the only one authorized to make changes to Dieter’s Google “Knowledge Panel” (ie. the panel showing photos of Elder Uchtdorf, along with his books, and links to his Twitter, Facebook, and Instagram pages) is the owner of the panel itself. So, if one wishes to unilaterally change any info on Dieter’s “Knowledge Panel” one reaches a screen that states:

    Verify that you represent Dieter F. Uchtdorf
    Sign in to one official site/profile below
    Twitter · @uchtdorfdf

    In other words: The only one who can change any info on Dieter’s Google Knowledge Panel is the person who knows the password to login to post tweets on Elder Uchtdorf’s Twitter Page, which presumably is Dieter the German aviator himself. (BTW, the same goes for Jeffery Holland’s panel, etc.)

    What do you think RFM? Am I lost in the weeds here? Am I missing something or does it seem that the church’s current leadership is trying to run away from its prophetic mantle for reasons possibly related to future legal issues?

  2. An encore for this podcast is needed. I would love to hear your prespective of how you enabled the game in different parts of your faith journeys ( new convert, apologist, bishop, podcaster…).

  3. You guys are not Tom Cruise yet until one of you or someone is able to get one of those Generals with huge egos on the witness stand and get them so worked up that he goes off scrip and yells you’re damn right I the lie or you’re damn right all 15 at the top are living our asses off because the members can’t handle the truth. I have point out already obvious to you and perhaps many of is. The top leaders only schedule and strange Q& A sessions with naive youth our young people at Harvard. They will never allow for Q & A with adult members because they realize people like RFM who have done their homework would show up. I would have included Bill in with RFM but they wouldnt even let Bill in the door and use the excuse this Q & A is only for members.

    Also, I have to say they I believe they will never even attempt to excommunicate RFM, because he is not only so well read on all of this, but also his knowledge of law , I believe RFM would clean their clocks and it would be a huge embassament that probably would gain world media attention.
    Lastly on tonight’s topic. Just as you mention whatever crestes emotional distress for Bill. Even though it’s been 50 years since seminary. Every time I think about the year of church history how they always couched Smith’s words as loving carefully worded and from God and they always couched words from Governor Lilburn Boggs as wicked, angry resentfu. For years this caused me to not trust government and not realize the importance of civic involvement. It causede to hate Governor Boggs. The church poisoned me with a lot of hate in other areas. This hate undermined love and appreciation for people of color and my Catholic friends. I believe just as certain industries are held financially liable for poisoning their employees with things like black lung or many other things. The mormon cult needs to be held financially liable for the cancer in my heart that has taken years to heal. Sincerely,. Jay Larsen

  4. It’s interesting that Satan has chosen to quadruple his demonic activity in the internet age. One would think that he’d be always operating at 400% since there does not appear to be any benefit by holding anything in the reserve.

    I wonder if the Q15 has a meter in HQ which lists at what “speed” the Devil is tempting people.

    “Hang on Henry! Lucifer is at is attacking in a blitz and has ramped up to 500% temptation.”

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